STR 136: Recovering from a Terrible “Guru” Experience (audio only)
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STR 136: Recovering from a Terrible “Guru” Experience (audio only)

August 14, 2019

This is the Stock Trader Reality Podcast, episode 136. All this information is on the internet, but to have it in such a
manner where it’s a course, or something that you can easily follow, or you can go by, that’s
what I was missing. (upbeat music) This is the Stock Trading Reality Podcast. Where you get to see the realistic side of a trader’s journey. Get inspired and stay motivated
by everyday, normal people who are currently on their
journey to trading success, who believes everyone should
visit Michigan at least once. Clay Trader. Unfortunately, I don’t have quite the crisp voice of Tim Allen, and if you, I don’t know how far and wide they play the TV commercials and radio commercials, they play them here in Michigan. I’m not exactly sure why, but anyways that’s a side point, but if you live around
the Midwest at least, I’m sure you’ve seen those
Pure Michigan commercials where you got Tim Allen’s voice, and you have some great scenery, and all that sort of stuff, and it’s, the State of Michigan
trying to raise money for tourists to come to the state. But I’m gonna go ahead and
pump the State of Michigan, even though I grew up in
Ohio and went to Ohio State, so we’re kind of like, you’re
not supposed to like Michigan, but I’ll give credit where credit is due. Michigan has some awesome places. As far as the beaches of Lake Michigan, and then you can go up
in Northern Michigan. And I’ve never even been
up to the upper peninsula, but I guess that’s just a
whole nother world up there, waterfalls, all sorts of stuff. But what amazes me the most
is if you go up far enough north in Michigan, to what’s
called Traverse City area, literally it’s like the Caribbean. You look at the lakes up
there, and it looks just like, you could plant some palm trees, and you wouldn’t know the difference. It’s crystal clear blue water, and the best part is,
there’s no sting rays, there’s no jelly fish,
there’s no Jaws out there that wants to take a bite out of your leg. It’s just good, freshwater lakes, and Chezz I know, Chezz by the
way is our esteemed co-host, you’ve, I’m trying to think,
is it your wife’s family, somebody has a house up in
the upper peninsula, right? Yep, yeah it’s practically Canada. It’s near kinda Minocqua
and it’s actually on what’s called Lake Gogebic
so unfortunately they just had to sell it, actually this year. But, yeah, it is like a whole different world up there. And like you said you’ve
only been to Travers City, is that like the farthest
UP have ever been? Yeah, exactly.
Alright. So I am like across Lake
Michigan on the other side there and it’s like I said,
it’s practically Canada but it’s still America as America gets. So the funny thing is
that I used to remember those Pure Michigan commercials
when I lived in Illinois ’cause obviously they’re advertising to whoever is closest to Michigan, but I don’t ever remember
Tim Allen being the narrator on that so while you
were kinda talking there I was YouTubing the Tim
Allen Pure Michigan ones and now I kinda understand
what you were saying. Oh, you’ll start weeping. You’ll wanna come to Michigan.
(laughing) His voice is so soothing,
they’re good commercials. Yeah. So you’ll agree though that people should at
least visit Michigan? The problem was that people where like Michigan, do you mean Detroit? Yeah, everybody always is like wait you mean I’m supposed to hang
out with Kid Rock and Eminem? No, there’s more to Michigan
than Detroit, people. Michigan is a huge, huge state and like you said you’re
pretty much nailed it, Michigan is much, much
more than just Detroit. It’s like Detroit is actually a small section of what Michigan really is. Unfortunately, what my experience is that when you say Michigan people’s mind automatically defaults
like the entire state. You’re from Michigan, oh
so you’re from Detroit. So it’s like where you can
buy a house for like ten bucks but Western Michigan, like,
just do a little research, do what Chezz does, do some
Pure Michigan commercials on YouTube and consider it as a vacation. It’s pretty cost effective. It is definitely cost effective. But we’ll move on to our interview which was pretty awesome. We’ve done this before in the sense of the interview just
starts off with us talking. And we’ve done it before when
we’ve brought people back but I think this is the first time that we’ve done it with a first time guest and Tom, he goes by
Tvessel in the chatroom, he just started to kind
of interview me at first and we went down some
interesting rabbit holes and we’re gonna have to
bleep out a bunch of stuff because I don’t want
this certain person to be sending cease and desist
orders to the company and threatening to sue
us, so we’re just gonna blot out names because I don’t feel like dealing with the headache because this person’s already proven to do that. But yeah, Tom starts off
with an absolute horror story and then has since
started to recover from it but I don’t want to let the
cat out of the bag any more so let’s get started with the discussion. Chezz, are you ready to go?
No. No, well we’re gonna start. Oh, I-N-S-M, look at that thing.
I want to fade that sucker. Podcast time. Did you see that one that I asked you a question with at the webinar last night? I did, what was the
ticker real quick, though? O-P.
Yeah, O-P. N or something.
O-P-N-T? I think.
Yep. Is that what it was? Tsk. Did you buy the breakout? I didn’t.
Come on! Holy crap, I bet it would’ve
been a good one, right? Yeah, yeah. Goodness. That’s what you
get for listening to me. Did the risk make sense? Yeah, 26 to 43, that would’ve been nice. You know what, I didn’t do it. Here’s a quiz, I’m gonna
put you on the spot. What’s the one problem with that, though? It sticks out right away, what
do you see that’s a problem? It starts with a P. Oh, and the V. (laughing) It’s going way worse than I had planned. Are you talking about the volume? Yes, it’s not even at
100 thousand shares yet. Yeah. You know what, yesterday, and
I screw around with FinViz and see different things
for different swings so I was trying some
different things with, like, a gain at three
percent and then a hammer or a loss at three percent with an inverted hammer and that one came up and I thought that
actually looks pretty good with the hammer but I
didn’t look at volume. You know, everything that when we’re doing the
webinars and different things I learn something every time. I start to think I’m
really new into this thing so I think that I’m starting
to get it and then I hear something like I didn’t
pay attention to volume. It’s like the more repetition
that we get the better off. Well, I can attest that because you’ve always kept in touch so those that email me or
ask questions or whatever obviously that’s easier for me to track but you’ve definitely made progress, yeah. But to be honest, and Chezz
can speak to this too, it’s like there’s always
gonna be something where in hindsight you’re
like oh, yeah I should have looked at that
especially on losing trades. You’re always gonna be like
oh, that was a losing trade because I forgot to look at that. Well, if it would have
been a winning trade would you have ever really, right? You would never have given
that a second thought. Yeah, right. Yeah. But I would definitely agree that volume is something
that you should be checking. Not that you would have wanted to avoid it but like I said in the
webinar, you’d wanna counter-balance that low volume. Yeah. You wouldn’t wanna be
like yep, I’m gonna go with 15 thousand shares in this thing. Alright, well you literally basically would have over ten percent
of the daily volume. Yeah, yeah. Yep, exactly. Hey, I was gonna ask you a question. So if you remember
before I actually joined and I joined (censored) and the day I joined (censored) I was thinking about CTU or (censored) and I fell for the fear of missing out or the whole bit so I end up doing that and once I did it. Oh, was it through that webinar thing? Yeah, I did, actually. The shadiest sales tactic in the world. So you did the live webinar thing? I did the live webinar. Live is in air quotes. Live, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Was it PH? Is that who has the website now? Yeah, he revised it again but I checked on the site and
now that one is even gone. So my guess is that he
got another legal notice that was like threatening him or whatever. Yep, yep, yep. I bet. So what happened with me is I went to that webinar thing or, yeah, their live webinar,
and I thought oh hell, in three months, or heck, in three months I could be a profitable
trader, this is perfect. So I got into it. Is that what they say is three months? Oh yeah, in three months. Really, so that’s what
the webinar is saying is that in three months you’re
gonna be a profitable trader? Well that’s more-or-less. So what they do is one month of training. The whole thing is three months. And part of their system is you have to devise and make a
game plan a little bit so at the end of the three
months you should be making a hundred dollars a day and
then it goes up from there. So the next month you’re 200 dollars a day and you’re just increasing it. But at the end of three
months you’re done. You can’t even get to your
recordings, nothing else. I started getting into
the thing and I thought oh man, I don’t think this is for me. So then I actually chatted
with you a little bit, Clay, and then I talked to (censored) by email and I said I think I made a mistake, I didn’t download anything,
I didn’t do anything, I said I think I’d like
to get out and they said well, you haven’t done your homework, you’re not giving it a chance. And I said okay, because
it’s a 30 day guarantee. And I said so what
exactly do I need to do. He said I want you to do it, really try, try your level of best
and do your homework. So I did that and was three weeks into it and it’s like this is totally a mistake. It gave some pointers
or gave some information but you say that in your training you’re annoying. You pound it down somebody’s
throat so it’s repetition, repetition and it’s like holy cow, Clay, I know, I know, I know. Good.
(laughing) But there’s so much to that because with the other
one they gloss over it and then it’s so, so fast and you get a little bit of information but it doesn’t sink in or
maybe I am just a slow learner. Because I need more, I need more repetition, I need more pounding into my head, I need to keep doing it
until it’s second nature and I didn’t have that so
I tried and I asked them I think I’d like to get out. He said well, before you can do that you have to make, and
I forgot what it was, 500 dollars in the Sim
Trader and I’m thinking heck, if I can make 500 buck,
if I can make 500 dollars then I think everything would be great. So at the end there when I’m thinking I have to make 500 dollars I would just wing it. I’m confused, so at first you have to do your homework, so what was this homework? Homework is nothing, it’s not like RVR. It sounds like stuff kept
getting thrown at you. Like you have to do your homework. You did your homework, okay,
well now you gotta make 500 dollars or is the 500
dollars part of the homework? No, no, 500 dollars is on top of it. He wants you to make 500
dollars in the Sim Trader. Okay, so after you do your homework which is what he originally told you to do now all of a sudden when
you have done your homework now he’s throwing something else at you. You have to make 500
buck in the Sim Trader. Okay, goodness. Well, if I could be doing
that I would have done it and I think that this would probably be a good fit for me but it is not. So, (censored) is more of
a, and don’t get me wrong they do have some training there but it’s like I said, it’s
just a once-over, a gloss-over and to me with CTU you
could go back forever. You can get back into it or
if something’s not hittin’ you can go through the course again. You can’t do that. Not only will you get annoyed with Clay the first time around but wait till you take the courses a couple times. (laughing) Then you will finish his
sentences and want to kill him. (laughing)
Yeah yeah. But I think it is
absolutely crazy that after three months your access
is pretty much revoked. That just seems nuts.
It is. Well I think it’s absolutely crazy that the whole premise is
that after three months you’re gonna be making 100 dollars a day. If that’s not Snake Oil at its
finest I don’t know what is. Yeah.
(exasperated sigh) A hundred dollars a day after three months and then you said the next month it’s supposed to be
like 200 dollars a day? Yeah. Yeah, yeah, exactly. So in four months you’re
making 200 dollars a day. Yeah. Talk about a load of crap. We’ll have to blot out the
names just because, yeah. Yeah, I don’t ever wanna do that. Well, I don’t want any
lawsuits thrown at us for somebody speaking the truth. Yeah, I’ll tell you how bad it is, and I’m sure Nate can cut this out, probably doesn’t want
it, but they had a guy, he was a moderator in their chatroom and he also did one-on-one mentoring and so I emailed him because
I just wasn’t getting the information I needed so
he did a Skype call with me. Super, super nice guy.
Honest as the day is long. Just a great, great guy and he said I can’t really give my opinion, he said, but things are gonna change
here in about a week or two. Well, he left (censored) because of their deceitful
tactics is what he felt it was. So he’s on his own, he’s
doing his own thing now and he said that it was, and
like I said this moderator, and, Nate, you’ll probably
wanna get this out of here, but his name is (censored)
super, super nice guy. And he is modest, just a sincere person. Anyway to the point where
he got out of (censored) because he said ethically I just can’t be involved with them. So they’re shady, it’s terrible. Yeah, that’s real shady. Go ahead. Especially after going from that and then coming to you it’s fantastic. Okay, glad you weren’t
saying it got even shadier. (laughing) It could’ve got worse
here at, oh boy.
(snickers) Yeah I thought it was bad there. Wow. And I’m biting my tongue because to sit there and be like
you’re gonna be making a hundred dollars a day after three months but after three months
you no longer get access to the content, well, you can
have access to the content again I’m sure if you paid all over again but, yeah, what a crock. And I’m not trying to turn
this into a sales pitch for Clay Trader University but yeah. It’s the churn and burn. That’s the business model
for him, the churn and burn. Yeah, that’s unbelievable. Oh well, anyways, well,
that was a super fascinating discussion and we’ll kinda get into more. Well, you kinda just gave
us some of your journey and that was a very interesting part of it but where actually did
all of this start for you? I mean, where did you first
hear about the markets and kind of what got you interested enough to want to get more hands
on and involved with it? I have always, I shouldn’t say always, but I am 48 years old, 47
years old, somewhere like that, I have always have added to my IRA, so I’ve invested and my mom was lucky
enough to really catch the internet boom and she wasn’t trained, didn’t have any formal education and she did very, very well and then she got to a certain point where she goes you know, I don’t really
feel comfortable with it. So she got out of the market
right before the crash. So I saw what she did and she did very, very well for herself and like I said I’ve always invested in my IRA and my wife and I are now empty Lesters at 48 years old and we’ve decided that we
kinda want to lighten our load and, you know, as far as financially. We want to travel a little bit more. A little bit of freedom
and space and time, yeah? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Exactly. And ultimately what I would like to do is be able to make a living and
not be location dependent. That’s my ultimate goal to everything. And in doing so I wanna try
and where we financially want to get the house paid
for, get everything paid for, not have any debt and
eventually change our lifestyle so we could actually be making a living, not necessarily becoming
rich, but making a living and not be dependent on a location. That’s ultimately what our goal is here. Well, first off the market is an absolutely great way to do that. Obviously it takes a lot of
hard work and effort, though. But none of this sounds
too uncommon to me at all and just the fact that,
and I venture to say that most of the places that
you and your wife wanna visit you’re gonna have internet,
there’s very few places in the world now that don’t
actually have internet. You know, swing trading
and stuff like that. There’s a ton of people that
do the same exact thing. What actually lead you to
kinda have that thought or was that something that
kinda creeped in over time as the years have gone on and
you have an empty nest now. Was that just something
that kinda hit you one day, like I kinda want to look into trading, I know some of my family
members had some success with that in the past, you know. What was the light bulb moment that said I should look deeper
into this trading stuff? I’ve always been interested
in the markets, always. And we’ve had family friends
who were stock brokers and they’ve done pretty
well for themselves. I think just seeing in my IRA
and what I could do in my IRA and I’m thinking, well, I don’t
know what the heck I’m doing and I’m thinking if that’s
just dumb luck and I’m able to do pretty well on my IRA
just think if I educated myself and could actually put some thought into what I’m doing because what I’ve done with my IRA is pure dumb luck, truthfully. That’s all there is to it. What has been your strategy in your IRA? Buy and hold. I use Schwab for my IRA and
they have different tools at Schwab where they
have different screeners for what they feel is and
A or a B or their rating and ultimately that’s what I’ve done is go through their Schwab ratings and to see something that is an A and I would do it, I would buy
it with my IRA contribution. Not having any stops or not really watching, I’d just buy it. So there are a number of years where my five grand IRA contribution
was gone in a month and other times where it went really well. Now, you said it was gone so were you actively selling, or what do you mean by gone? You realized you were down quite a bit and then it has come back? I guess define gone. I remember one year I bought in and I thought I’m gonna buy E Toys. E Toys was a ticker because it was somewhere around
Christmas so I bought E Toys and within a couple months it was literally defunked, it was gone. Oh, so you’re talking penny stocks. No!
(chuckles) It wasn’t even a penny stock. So this wasn’t a penny stock company? No, no. No.
(chuckles) So there’s been many times where I lost, you know, my IRA contribution for that year went to nearly nothing. Right.
Yeah, yeah. So you were basically
not going and buying, let’s say, Coca-cola or
buying AT&T, you were buying what would be considered
speculative companies. Yeah, well, some of them. Other ones I bought
were United Health Care when it was, you know, I think I bought that a couple different times. The last time I bought it at 118, and I think it’s 200 or 199 now. So there are certain ones
that have been fantastic and other ones that were total stinkers. Okay, so you summarized it perfectly with dumb luck. I was gonna try to make a point that well, it wasn’t really dumb luck
because you were buying good blue chip companies,
the trade off would be that you have to hold it a long
time to realize those gains but, no, that’s not what you’re doing. Some blue chips maybe but
other times you were just buying random toy companies
that went defunked. So it really was dumb luck because there was no strategy at all. Exactly. Well, thanks a lot, Tom,
you stole my thunder. I was about to come and make a great point about the trade off between patience and, you know, returns but,
yeah, that was literally dumb luck so you weren’t kidding. So at what point in
time were you just like, and I like how you said you know, if I actually put some
knowledge behind these actions, you know, imagine what I could do, or what I could do if I
was just throwing darts. So how long did this
quote-unquote dumb luck stage go before you
decided and before that kind of light bulb came
on and where you were thinkin’ like I wanna
get more knowledgeable and then after that
what was your next step? So, probably about two years ago then I really started
trying to dig in with educating myself, not formal
education just internet based. You know, me looking through
the internet. Doctor Google. I learned some things but,
I think you’ve summed it up, you said before that all this
information is on the internet but to have it in such a
manner where it’s a course or something that you can easily follow or you can go by, that’s
what I was missing. Like I said probably about two years ago I started to more
investing educating myself and I started learning a little bit. In December of ’16, so
not quite a year ago, I decided it’s time to
actually invest in my education and that’s when I started to
actually pay for education. Correct me if I am wrong, and first off I love your
Doctor Google reference, it makes it sound better
than Googling things, so Doctor Google, I’m gonna
have to use that in the future. I mean, we’re in full
agreement that there’s a ton of information out there
but correct me if I’m wrong the problem you had was that
it’s not really structured. It’s just tidbits all over the place and then if you’re lucky you
can splice it all together. Is that right? That’s exactly what it is. And who knows, there’s so
much information out there. Who knows if it’s true or if it’s just somebody’s thoughts. Until you have an actual
program or have an actual course to meet anybody,
that’s what I needed. And I’m not smart enough
to put it all together. I can’t put all the pieces
together just from the internet. I need more structure so that’s
what I decided to invest in. Gotcha. Well, we’re obviously glad
that you found this place. After the horror story from before, yeah. What we really try to do is we understand that becoming a profitable
trader can take more than three months and more likely than not it should take you the three months to just go through the courses and maybe just start paper trading then. Obviously we’re going for much more of a, especially for university members, if you guys aren’t aware you’re
pretty much members for life and have access to everything
that was ever started from day one here which
is kind of, in my opinion, that’s exactly why I personally joined ’cause I realize it’s going to take kind of a continuous education cycle, it’s not something you just
check the check list off and you take a course and then I’m done. Trading, it changes every single day, the market’s different every single day, a lot of the stuff is the
exact same, but still. There’s different times
of volatility, you know. Trading around the election time was a real eye-opener and
how crazy that stuff was. But you join pretty much
university in December. No, nope. Oh, so you just got a couple courses? Actually I joined a different
competitor in December and I actually joined CTU in March of ’17. Gotcha. Gotcha, okay. I think we kinda covered earlier it sounds like you’re pretty pleased with switching over to Clay Trader, or am I just putting
words in your mouth now? No, I couldn’t be happier. (laughs)
I really couldn’t. I love the constant, you
know, going to the chatroom. You can always get ahold of you or Clay or Nate for that matter. To have somebody there
that while I am learning to simply text and ask a question and just to have somebody
there is comforting and to have that community is huge. I’m a lurker in the chatroom.
(laughing) There’s nothing wrong with that. Nothing wrong with that,
some people type up too much and other people like Tom
here don’t type up enough. (laughing)
So true. But at the same time it’s like you said it’s more about we don’t need you to do a bunch of contributions
and welcome every new member, you are here for the community and that’s exactly what
you’re getting out of it. So now you’ve been a member
here for about six months and have you kinda gone
through all the courses now, are you paper trading,
are you still working your way through the courses, what’s that kinda looking like for ya? Before you answer that, though, I had a quick question just so
I can gain a little context. What was your goal going
in to education as a whole? Were you always wanting to trade stocks or were you open to options or, I mean, what particular vehicle have you always kind of at least had your focus on? I’ve always done stocks, equities, just strictly because I
didn’t know anything else, I didn’t know about options
so I have not dabbled into options yet, I haven’t gone
through the options courses. What I’m trying to do is get a general, you know, really hammer in
my general understanding and my chart knowledge, try
to correlate my chart vision to, you know, like what we said earlier, to watch the chart, to watch the volume, to really pay attention to the volume and the different patterns
and then once I get that then I want to get into options
and see if maybe options are something that I want to work with. Okay, so the whole time you were used to stocks so you
always wanted to do stocks. It’s not like you joined any
of these educational programs because you wanted to
learn something else, you’ve always been focused on stocks and obviously now you said you’re working on your chart vision, you
wanna learn how to use charts, so, I mean, are you, to kinda circle back to Chezz’s question, are you paper trade right now, are you still going through courses, what exactly does you current
status of things look like? So I’ve gone through probably half of the courses. I did paper trade when I
was with the other program and then when I came to
CTU I was paper trading. You guys are gonna love
this, with the other program I was with I joined Sure Trader. (exasperated sigh)
Yeah, yeah I know. Been there.
It’s terrible. It’s a right of passage but if you can avoid it,
please, god, avoid it. No kiddin’ and you know somebody said to us that
as far as commissions, you know, death by a thousand paper cuts could not be any more truer than that. Especially when you’re learning
and you do have a winner, you know, usually they’re not that big and to have the commissions
where they’re at, especially if you’re trying to scale out. You know, when you’re
scaling out if you go in and mitigate a certain point
and then hit your stop, that’s 15 dollars in commissions
for trade with Sure Trader. Let me ask this real quick, was this other program,
the horror story program, what they were trying to teach you did it involve scaling
out and all that stuff? Yes. Yeah, it did.
(snarky laugh) And they’re the ones that shoved you to Sure Trader, right? Yeah, yeah. Yeah they did, in fact they said you get somewhat of a discount for going for them. (pained groan) Yeah, you see, this is that other person you mentioned, his feelings
were absolutely right. Let’s put this into context. Okay, our strategy that
we’re teaching people means you have to scale out, fine, I have no qualms with that, but
we’re gonna get kickbacks if we shove them to this broker here. Sure this broker is gonna rack,
or reek, rapt, what is that? Rack them over the coals? Rack them over the coals with commissions. Rake them over the coals. Chezz, I knew that. See? That’s why you always get
host of the year every year. No, I’m just a pretty face. Yeah, exactly, he’s much more. Yeah, our strategy is you
scale out a bunch of times but let’s just rake ’em over the coals and shove ’em to a broker
that’s gonna just whoop ’em because we’re gonna get a kickback. So, yeah, that’s just shady
business practices at best. Here you are trying to use this broker that they recommend to do their strategy that they’re teaching
you and yet it’s totally counterintuitive because the broker that they’re shoving in your
face is making basically their strategy impossible because of all the fees they’re charging you. If that’s not a catch 22,
just counterproductive. (sighs)
Yeah. Shady at best. Take a breather, Clay. It’s okay.
That’s bad. We know.
Yeah. That’s rough, that’s rough. Yeah, yeah I think so. And it just drives me nuts because I know it’s going
on behind the scenes with this person sending out lawsuits or threatening lawsuits against people that are just telling the
truth about what’s going on. Anyways, so talk to us
more about Sure Trader because they have high
fees, what were your other experiences because Chezz and
I would hear it all the time, hey, I’m thinking about Sure Trader because I can get around the
patterned day trader rule. So, I mean, we don’t
talk about them enough but when we do get somebody
that’s brave enough to fess up to using them,
so thank you for that. So, just share with the
listeners. What else? So fees, like you said
absolutely terrible. Any other experiences with ’em? Well, the fees are huge. So they use the DAS, D-A-S, Trader. I think that was 125, 130 bucks a month,
somewhere like that, I believe, that you had to pay. They charge for that now? Yeah, oh yeah, for sure. Wow. Wow, okay. So you have to, and you think about it that does include level two
for them also in that fee, you know, so you have to profit, you know, after you commissions you
have to profit, you know 120, 130 a month just to break
even because of the fees. Now it was expensive in that respect plus the commissions, of course, are high, and then trying to get any customer service was
really, really a bugger. Ya know, when you were
trying to take money out. Eventually I decided, okay,
I gotta get out of this and I switched to Interactive Brokers. I don’t have enough to get over the PDT, well, I shouldn’t say
that, we do have savings and I could do it but I don’t
want to get into our savings. Let’s still stay on top of it, let’s keep on bashing Sure
Trader with the facts. (exasperated laugh)
Okay. We’ll get back to that, though. I could sense the tangent you headed on. Don’t go down that rabbit hole quite yet. Okay, okay. Well, uh, customer service. Customer service, walk us
through customer service. It’s nearly nonexistent
to get customer service. If you do chat, you can’t call them, or I have never got through
callin’ ’em, but you can chat. Even when you chat there’s probably a ten, 15 minute wait to chat and, you know, there may be super nice people that are working there but let me just say that the customer service leaves a lot to be
desired, that’s for sure. Well I want to jump in here, I’m not sure if you’d heard
from the other podcast, so while they might be the
nicest people in the world they’re not able to kinda
function and use a calculator because I remember when
I deposited money there I was actually shorted
a couple hundred dollars and I had to, like, send a frantic email. Like, yeah, how do you not
understand what I deposited. Like, what kind of
operation is going on here. So they probably do all
that kind of stuff by hand which, you know, obviously
interactive brokers and all those guys, everything
else is automated there but, yeah, I logged into
my new, shiny Sure Trader account and it was missing money already on, like, day one and I was like this is gonna go poorly I
can just already tell now. Oh yeah. Could be the nicest people in the world, can’t use a calculator. Like I said, they can’t
understand the type of people who are gonna come to them and obviously they are doing really we considering it kind of avoids some
laws and there’s some gray area there they are utilizing. But it sounds like you realize. So, how long were you
actually at Sure Trader before you decided that this
wasn’t gonna work for ya? Probably about three months, I’d imagine. Yeah, pretty close to three months. And you know what really
scared me was, you know, it was an offshore broker
so anything could happen. I don’t think they’re
governed by our laws. No, they’re not.
(laughing) So it’s really a leap of faith. There’s really a leap of faith with them. They could literally hit the ATM and hop in a boat ’cause
they’re in the Bahamas. Yep, they can just hop
on a boat and drive away. Yeah, I was thinking what
the heck am I doing here. I eventually was able to get out of that and then switch brokers. It sounds like you were originally talking about trying
to withdraw some money and was that kind of a con show or was that a pretty smooth process? Oh my gosh, no. It was not smooth. Not smooth at all. I shouldn’t say that. I haven’t tried taking
money out at all at IB, I haven’t made any money to take it out. I promise you it’s real easy. (laughs)
Yeah. Well, going in, even transferring in at IB was amazing compared
to doing a wire transfer and the different baloney that you had to do with Sure Trader. Define baloney, because everything, is it all rainbows and butterflies and sweet, little kittens until
they get into the trenches. So tell your trench story
about trying to withdraw money. What was all this baloney? I think it ended up taking, and I think once I did the
paperwork for the withdrawal, I think it was two and a half
weeks before it was actually in my account in the states and I had to email and text them for the last week to get them and I actually
made up a bit of a story. I said that I had some health issues and I needed the money
and blah, blah, blah, thinking that maybe that
would help out a little bit. Yeah, they take their sweet time getting your money back, that’s for sure. And I know there’s newer
listeners out there that are probably jump
to the aid of Sure Trader saying there’s no way I could day trade, even though I know that’s not true, without a broker like Sure Trader. I wanna tell you the biggest
red flag in the world. Sure Trader, along with some other, you know, Europeans, 4X brokers, is the only place in the
world I’ve ever seen a broker say you can fund your
account with a credit card. A credit card, yes. Yeah, so I was so nervous about using them I used the credit card
’cause, like, I’ll just charge it back if they try to rob
me or something like that. That could have been a
whole process in itself. And here’s the thing, though,
you funded your account with a credit card, you can only get paid the way you funded it so they just will put refunds on your credit card. So I was like how do people seriously justify that this is a real broker? Do you think anybody
with a six figure account is getting refunds on their credit card and this is kinda how they do it? The fact that you can
fund a trading account with a credit card is,
like, just such a no-no. And I unfortunately used
it but I was using it more like I have fraud protection
and stuff like that. Chezz, it’s okay.
(laughs) Was this one of your moron
moments when you first got started, we all have moron moments. Oh, this was brand new moron moment, penny stock, Sure Trader
Chezz, yes, that’s correct. Okay, ’cause, I mean my big moron moment, if you’re not familiar with the show, is paying, like, 60 dollars
in commission one-way. Yeah. So we all have moron moments, but yeah. When I was brand new I
didn’t know any better, and most people don’t know any better and it sounds like it’s a perfect deal. What’s that saying, if it sounds too good to be true? I can’t remember how the
rest of that saying goes. Yeah. Yeah.
(laughs) Hook, line, and sinker. But Chezz nailed it earlier when he said there’s a certain demographic that they’re going after and, you know, for you listeners if you
can’t connect the dots with the demographic the
whole funding your account with a credit card that
should have the dots colliding right now in terms of what their
business model actually is, who they’re trying to go after, and I guess for you, Tom,
good on you at three months, a relatively short amount of time, where you were just like
alright, I need to move on. So on that note, you
found Interactive Brokers. Yeah. What did you like about
Interactive Brokers? Kind of how did you hear
about Interactive Brokers, walk us through kind of that little rabbit hole of this whole broker. Well, at that moments I was still at CTU and a lot of the members of
CTU use Interactive Brokers. To me with the CTU, or, I’m sorry with the chatroom there’s a lot of people, they’re normal people and
they’re honest and sincere. It’s not like Clay Trader talking, because who knows it you’re
being sincere or not, if you are being truthful or if you’re just trying to sell you product. But these are people who are actually in there, they have nothing to gain, you know, everybody in the chatroom. You know, everybody I
talked to had nothing but great things to say
about Interactive Brokers so that’s ultimately why
I did Interactive Brokers. So it’s not like, and to your point, yeah, it’s not like what
broker should I use, guys, and then a bunch of affiliate links show up for Interactive Brokers. I assure you that the chatroom
does not operate like that. Yeah, Interactive Brokers,
IB, they’re one in the same. So everybody said it was a great broker but what did you
particularly like about it? Especially compared to Sure Trader? Besides customer service it sounds like Interactive Brokers are
probably much better but, you know, what other functionalities have you kind of learn to really enjoy and find useful with Interactive Brokers? Well, as far as the platform goes the platform is just amazing,
I love the chart trader on Interactive Brokers
where you can actually. I am more of a visual person so with other systems when you’re punching in numbers where here you can actually,
with Interactive Brokers when you’re using chart trader
you actually have a line, it shows you where you got in, it shows you where your stop is. When I move my stop it’s
only because, you know, I’m in a profitable trade
and my stop is going down or, you know, I’m trying something. Reducing risk rate.
Yeah, yeah. Exactly, where you can
actually see it with your eye and you can see your entry and you can see where your stop is and you can
see exactly what’s going on. I just absolutely love their actual trading platform, it’s amazing. And getting money in is simple. Yeah it definitely is. And I kind of used Interactive
Brokers in the past too. They’ve taken the time,
there’s a reason why Interactive Brokers can afford to kind of, you know, put on television ads, you know, for the Super Bowl and stuff like that because they make a good
amount of money in commissions at the same time they really do offer a good customer experience. I used to be able to hop on the chat and get answers in five, six minutes if I ever had an issue with anything and I rarely had any outages
or anything like that. But I kinda wanted to loop
back into something else and I think, Clay, I don’t know
if you would agree with this but it seems like, and
I’m not sure if it’s just different ways that people learn, but I’m in the same boat
as Tom in the sense of anything that has a visual chart trader, you know I used to, ya
know, when I traded futures I used the visual chart trader
for Interactive Brokers, I used Sierra Chart, Trading
View you can do it too. I just think it helps
people better visualize, you know, spoiler alert
for some of the webinars we actually, ya know, when
we’re doing trade plans and stuff like that,
we’re visually setting up our risk versus reward,
targets, stops, all that and I think it just almost
is a more seamless way for people, especially when
they’re just getting into it, to kind of visualize it and see oh yeah, that totally fits my RVR criteria or anything like that but, I mean, you never really had a
chart trader, did ya, Clay? Because I know you use E
Signal and stuff like that and I know you can link
’em but you’ve never used a visual chart trader, have you? Yeah, right now I feel like a straight up caveman savage, I mean, I might as well be using, like, a stick and rock to try
to start my fire over here because that was a good sales pitch and the funny part is just
yesterday David Crouse, who has been a guest in the past, he was talking about why he
liked Interactive Brokers over Light Speed, and Light
Speed’s a broker I use, but this is all just
personal preference, right? At the end of the day remember, listeners, a broker is just a tool, if you don’t know how to use a tool it
doesn’t matter anyway. They will not make or break you. You are the ultimate reason for that. Exactly, and David’s point was exactly what Tom was just saying the chart trader makes
everything super visual. But I didn’t realize you can, now, Tom, can you, like, click right there and say that’s where I want my new stop loss to be and it automatically changes
your stop loss to that? Yeah, so the way I have it set up is I have it so when I enter
I automatically have a stop. So the second I enter I
have my stop already set then I can adjust my
stop however I want to. So you just go up and
you, Clay, it’s like when you’re doing your webinars
and you actually have your entry or your stop
with your horizontal lines. With the lines?
Yeah. That’s exactly what it is. When you move that line
you’re movin’ your stop. It’s amazing.
Oh wow. Yeah, it’s really nice. Yeah, that’s a good sales pitch. You said Trading View has that, Chezz? Well, Trading View now can link to certain brokers. So by no means am I
advocating that you use Trading View to your execution of stuff but what I tried to tell people lately is that since Trading View
charts are essentially free it’s a great way to paper trade ’cause you can paper trade
right on the charting platform and it’s exactly like
Tom was saying, ya know. You can set limits, stops,
and in there it’s just click and drag and it’ll literally
update your orders for you. Very, very visual, it’s
just a very seamless way to kinda go from what
you teach in the courses to actually applying it
to charts in real time. So that’s why I kind of recommend that for the paper trading people lately. Exactly. I’ve been with Light Speed for years. Cave man.
Yeah. I don’t know, Light
Speed, if you’re listening maybe think about a chart trader. Yeah, I don’t know the
dark side is looking. Nah, nevermind, I’m not gonna do Star Wars ’cause that really doesn’t make any sense. It’s kind of funny. You know, I would be so uptight right now but given this is like episode 136 I am past the point of really
caring what people think. I’ve had every mean thing
possible said about me so at this point, yeah, whatever, that made no sense but I don’t care. Cave man, savage, yeah. Yeah, say it. It doesn’t matter. I’m a cave man savage,
I’m over here right now trying to start a fire with flint. You were gonna say something, Tom, before my ill-advised
Star Wars quote popped up? Yeah, you know, you’re talking about when I was saying I am
a more visual person when I was with Sure Trader and I had hot keys set up. So, I had a thing where I got into a trade and I hit my hot key and instead of going short I went long and then I panicked so I hit it again and then I hit it again. Well, every time I did
that I bought 200 shares, 200 shares, 200 shares.
(laughing) Tripled the size, yeah. But the wrong way and then I have an oh heck key that I had programmed in and so I hit that and that
was a 600 dollar loss. At that point I only had
5000 dollars in Sure Trader and that was, like, devastating to me. It was like oh my god,
and that’s when I’m saying I’m like so much more a visual person so if I can actually
have lines on my chart and see exactly what it is
I’m not gonna be the fastest, I don’t need to be the fastest, that’s not the way that I’m
comfortable with trading. So if I can just move a
line down and that’s my stop and know what I’m doing that’s
the confirmation that I need. Nice, and I love you said you’re not gonna be the fastest nor is any human being out there, the only way that you can be the fastest is go find an investor
that’s gonna invest in super high fob fiber optic cable, hire some good Koreans that can write some good programming for you and then go and buy super computer and then you can be the fastest trader out there. But, yes, for us mere mortals there’s only so much
you can do with speeds. Yeah. I love how you said that because, yeah, none of us are
gonna be the fastest ever. It just is what it is in this day and age. But you don’t need to be the fastest ever, you need to let the
computers do their thing and then we’ll do our
things as human traders. You are trading with real
money, is that accurate? Yeah, I have been ever
since I have been with CTU. But it’s very small.
So let’s pick it up. So has it always been very
small or did you have to learn a tough lesson by
starting off too big? Yeah.
Walk us through. You were paper trading with,
you know, horror story company. Yeah. Then you come to CTU and
I do remember you saying you started with cash so
let’s pick it up from there. How did that all unfold, you know, what was I guess why cash? What made you decide to change over? With horror story I was paper trading then I went cash and then
I got beat up pretty good then I went back to paper trading and I could do pretty darn
good with paper trading, there’s no patterned day trading rule, there’s very, to me, there’s
not quite as much motions. I’ve heard you ask this before, I was very unrealistic with my size. It wasn’t like I was doing, ya know, ten thousand shares or something I was doing a hundred
shares and I had my stop at my certain point where
that was all realistic. There’s just something
about paper trading. I think paper trading is good to get a handle on your software. On your chart?
Uh, yup. That platform, I have
a familiarity with it. So you’re not making, like I said before, hitting my hot key and I’m adding when I’m supposed to
be taking off, ya know, that kind of thing paper
trading is fantastic for. And I think you need to paper
trade to a certain point but then eventually the
rubber has to hit the road. The rubber has to meet the road where the emotions, even if
I only have ten shares money’s money, I mean
that really hits home. It’s way harder for me, anyways, to be profitable with real
money versus paper trading. Paper trading, I feel it’s, like I said it’s easier to let it get right up to your stop. You know I always have
stops either way I go. But, ya know, I don’t feel emotion. There’s not that much emotion
when it’s gonna be like oh man it’s gonna hit my
stop, gonna hit my stop. Where when you have real money it’s night and day difference for me. I feel like Clay is gonna
start crying over there because first off, kudos
to you when you say rubber needs to hit the road,
you are absolutely right but I am so glad to
hear you say, you know, instead of a hundred shares
that I even paper traded with I’m just gonna put ten on, or, I mean it can be as low as you want it. It can be one tenth of the
size you’re paper trading with. If you still aspire to get
to that size, you know. Like I said, we always
talk about and preach about how keep it realistic, if
you’re gonna be trading a hundred shares then at least practice with a hundred shares but at the same time the emotional disconnect is very true but it doesn’t even
matter your size so much, pretty much ’cause once
money’s on the line that’s when a these terrifying voices and awful, ya know, the
devil sitting on you shoulder telling you to do everything horrible in the world that comes out. But that’s the thing,
though, is that you have to start to experience that without kinda putting your account at risk so very glad to hear you do that but, yeah, it’s just a very, very, you know, and correct me if I’m wrong here, I was thinking a lot about this before, you are much more willing
to forgive yourself for losing trade in you paper account because you’re like okay, no big deal, but then a losing account
on your actual account you’re like oh, that was x percent oh and I have to recover
this now and figure this out. It’s a much more psychological game. I’m in full agreement that
you do need to paper trade not only to get familiar
with your platform but to kinda, you know, at least insure that you know what you’re looking for for an entry and exit and stuff like that. Yeah, those voices,
though, they’ll get ya. Yeah, for sure. And see, right now I don’t
have a fully funded account so I’m not over the PDT hurdle. Every chance I get I’m putting money in to try and get that up over the 25 and so I have limited trades, you know, per a week. I only have three trades and I use those very, very sparingly and it just almost is the certain times I get more mad at myself
for wasting a trade versus the money because I
don’t have that much money. You know, the trades are
not, you know I don’t have huge size and I don’t have huge risk because of my stop loss but every chance, you know, those are like gold. Those trades are like gold
if you’re not fully funded and that’s what I think
the lure of Sure Trader is, you know, you can trade as much as your heart contends. And pays as much commissions as their hearts content,
as gladly accepts. Now, what kind of trading are you doing? I’m assuming these are all
inter-day, short-term day trades or are you doing some swing trading also? I’m starting to do more swings. It’s because of my work schedule that I can do a little bit in the morning and that’s about all I can actually fit in and so I’m starting to try and do a little bit more swing trading. Again, I do some swing in my retirement account and then my day trading account, and when I say day trading I’m just talking Interactive Brokers. So that’s day trading, swing, same thing. So I’m just starting to dabble a little bit with swings in my IB account. Okay, and do you have any sort of, I guess let me ask this, what
does your routine look like? You mention, you know, your work schedule so you currently have
a job so when are you kinda doing your homework,
is this something pre-market in the evenings but, you know, walk listeners through kind of how you’re constructing your trade
plans, how you’re constructing all that, you know, as
somebody with a day job. So for swings I try to go every night. My wife and I talked about this, you know, what I would like to do and she’s 100 percent on board so all the time I need
she’s fantastic with it, couldn’t ask for anything better. Every single night I either
do coursework through CTU, if it’s a live webinar
I train through that, sometimes I go through back webinars, but then I always try to look
at and go through Fin Viz and do some scans and make a watch list and that’s how I’ve been doing my swings and I’m very, very in the
beginning stages of doing that. I’ve done more paper with
swings than anything so far. So that’s how I handle the swings. As far as the day trading aspect of it I will go in, and I have with IB they have scanners that are great that I use,
I also use Think or Swim, use their scanners and
I did, when I was with the other program they
strongly suggested Trade Ideas so I got a one year
subscription to Trade Ideas which is great so between
those three scanners, and there’s a lot of redundancy between those three scanners
so I think I’ll be able to get rid of Trade Ideas because with IB and Think or Swim the scanners that I have set up a lot
of ’em are the same ones so I’ll take a look at the scanners and, you know, see what
the active ones are then what I try to do is
have one or two on watch. I don’t know if I’m not quick
enough or what exactly it is but if I try to watch five
or six I’ll miss everything so I tried to go down to
two when it comes time and that’s the way I do my morning. And I promise you as time goes on you will be able to start
kinda watching more at a time but especially being kinda newer to this you only have two eyes,
in reality you can only focus on one monitor at a time but trying to do multiple trade plans, multiple entries, scaling,
all this kind of stuff less is more especially in the beginning. So only focusing on two and hopefully if you found one that’s got
a lot of volume and interest you should have some good
volatility in range but yeah. Later on, you know,
especially if you go down the swing trading route you can watch many more because you don’t have to make split second decisions. That’s where day trading
will really kinda test you is your split second decision making. But Tom, I has been an absolute
pleasure having you on today but I do have to ask
you what did you think your particular strengths
are right now in trading? (deep sigh) I would have to say my strength would have to
be sticking to my stops. I forgot there was a
podcast not too long ago and they were saying that
actually sticking to your stops too much, not sticking to your stops but trying to reserve your
capital might hinder you sometimes, I’m almost
to that point, actually. But my one positive thing is I will never, ever, once I set a stop I will never move it to give myself more room, I’ll only move it to lock in profits. Right, your risk is only
gonna be getting smaller, you’re never gonna move your stop loss where all of a sudden your
risk is getting bigger. Exactly, yep. I’m kinda jealous, that’s a great strength to have. Most people that’s always a weakness. I’m jelly, is that what the
kids are saying these days, Chezz?
(laughing) Oh boy, Clay. Go water
the lawn and yell some. Ah man, I’m just trying to stay hip. (snickering)
Man, the cave man. I’m jelly over here,
okay, of your strength. What about some things that
you probably need to work on? So weakness, probably, yeah.
We will call it what it is. A weakness that you’re saying, yeah, Tom, that’s something I need to be focused on and keep on working with? I would have to say I have to have better timing. I have to watch for my entry. It’s starting to sink in now
where I know where my entry should be and trusting that
it’s time and then actually committing and hittin’ the
button and actually clicking. Whereas there are certain times where I’ll see descending triangle and I’ll see, yeah,
that’s a certain point, I need to get in there or just below it, if it breaks that line I should enter and I’ll be watching it, watching it, watching it, watching it,
and it goes and I miss it. There’s a certain point where I need to commit on certain things. And it all kind of plays into kinda the motions and stuff like that that kinda play into it
because I’m the same way. For more than a year I
was extremely gun shy because I was like ah, if I take the trade then I could lose but on the other hand if you never take the trade
you never make anything either. Yeah, that’s just another
thing you’re gonna have to wrestle with and wrangle with and I promise you, you know,
if you keep your trade size small enough eventually it’s not that you don’t care it’s
that you’re indifferent to it being a winner or a loss
and that’s what trading is. It’s just really a numbers
game and a probabilities game but it definitely takes time, you know. None of this three
months and you’re making a hundred dollars a day and
then two hundred dollars a day. Chezz, I know what you’re trying to do. You’re trying to push
my buttons with that. I’m bating you, yeah. I’m bating you into
hating me. Tom, go ahead. The way I almost feel about it is I need to try and I had to survive as far as my capital,
I just need to survive until I get beat up little by little and learn from it, ya know, from every hit you learn a little bit and
that’s my thing at this point. I just need to stay in
the game until I get it. That’s my biggie. And you’re already ahead of the game because most people go big or go home and all of those folks generally go home and we’ve seen it a bunch of times. So you are in survival
mode, learning mode, and kinda keepin’ yourself
in the game for the long haul and that’s what ultimately it is. But if I was to lend you my time machine and you could go back
to any point you want in your life and pretty much give yourself one piece of advice, what
would that advice be? I think it would be starting
my education sooner. I think that’s really the only
thing that I would change. Now, just starting in sense of just hopping into a structured
program right away or starting Doctor Googling even sooner, how are you defining start you education? An instruction program. I think, you know, Doctor Google I learned maybe a little bit there it’s kind of wasting time. To really get to jump in
to a structured program, I wish I had done it sooner. And, of course I am biased with CTU. But that’s really, really
hard to try and find a program that somebody’s
not just out there trying to make money off you. Of course you’re in business
so you’re trying to make money. The internet is kind of a scary place. Yeah, well, there’s no
place else on the site, I assure you, where the
drift, the implications are, yeah, within three
months you’re gonna make a hundred dollars a day, yeah. So I get what you’re
saying, there’s nothing on the site that suggests
anything of that nature. More often than not we’re telling people to get their head out of the clouds and be ready for the long haul. We’re like dream crushers
more than anything. Yeah, many times we’re like your best option right
now is to go get a job. Trading is not for you
in this point in time. And, yeah, we have several videos on that. Yeah, sorry to cut you off, Tom. No, I’d say you’re exactly right. Of anything you’re so
realistic in your sales that it might hurt your sales as far as, you know, ’cause you’re not
saying what people wanna hear. You’re being truthful. Yes, and the truth can be
costly but, I don’t know. People, we’re still going strong at 136 so apparently people also like the truth. But that’s the kind of people we want to surround ourselves with anyways so I mean it’s the people that show up wanting to be degenerate gamblers, yeah you’re really not gonna
find a better community to be a bunch of jerks
because we’ll just tell you right off the get-go,
yeah, you’re a gambler, what are you doing, maybe you should go get a job if you’re
trying to grow an account. But anyways, we’re
spinning out of control. But we’re gonna spin to my favorite, well, not really the favorite part, but this is the part you should be nervous about, the fun questions. Tom, what is your favorite movie? I like dumb movies so my favorite movie is “Joe Dirt” without question. (chuckles) That was super popular I remember when I was back in college,
that was David Spade. Have you ever see that one, Chezz? Yeah, absolutely, and I’ve seen it more than once too. What would it be considered
just a stupid comedy? Yeah definitely dumb, yeah.
Just a dumb ol’ comedy. It’s not a movie that’s
gonna challenge you to think in any way but
it will make you laugh, at least it used to do to me a lot. I love it. It is not a “Casablanca.” It is not a “Casablanca,” that is definitely for sure. But, Tom, what would you say is your favorite meal or dessert? I would have to say either a nice rib eye or smoked ribs and then right now I’m digging any type of
Halo Top Ice Cream, love it. Yeah, that’s the stuff that’s supposed to be super healthy, right? I don’t know if it’s a pint or what it is but like 200, 300 calories, it’s amazing. Yeah, so and it’s good? Fantastic, I love it. Some
are better than others. You gotta try it. But for the calories of it it’s not like you’re eating cardboard? Oh god, yeah, it’s Arctic Zero is like eating cardboard,
Halo Top is amazing. Okay, I’ve seen it at
the local grocery store. Yeah, I have too.
Yeah, okay. Based on your recommendation I’m gonna have to give it a try. You gotta try it, it’s great. Dude, now, what about flavors? Are there any flavors you should avoid or is it pretty much fire at will? They’re all pretty good. My favorite is the one I think
it’s chocolate peanut butter. My favorite. Like a Reese’s almost. And it’s only 300 calories? Some are like 280, some are 320, but they’re right around 300
calories for the whole pint. So you can feel less bad about eating the whole pint, Clay. Yeah.
Yeah, exactly. It sounds like I found my
dessert for this weekend. You gotta try it, I wanna
hear how you like it. No, I will definitely try it for sure. What do you like to do for
hobbies outside of the market? What do you do for fun and hobbies? It’s kinda funny, right
now the market is my hobby. Every chance I get, even when I’m driving I’ll listen to podcasts or
books on tape about trading. But I love it, love it, love it. But probably in the summer camping. My wife and I like to go camping. Nice. Man after my own heart. Yeah I was gonna say Kelly, Chezz, you’re gonna like that. Yeah, Kelly and I think have been out almost 30 days so far for this summer so that is like a new
world record for both of us so we’ve been out four day
trips, three day trips, we’re actually just camping on Labor Day. Fantastic.
Yeah that’s awesome. Love it. It’s nice to get out
and sleep in the fresh air. But what do you think are
three words you believe should be associated
with successful trading? You know, I was thinking about it because I have listened to every podcast but I’m thinking passion, you
really have to love this game. Passion would be one, patience, waiting for the trade to actually come to you not forcing
trades, and then humility to really know when you’re wrong and admit when you’re wrong. I thought you were gonna go for P-cubed; Passion, patience, and persistence. (groans)
I like humility. No, humility really fits in there. Yeah, you one-upped me big time there. That was good, PPH.
I like PPH. Yeah, PPH, but very well said. This was awesome. So, ya
know, here’s the thing. I don’t really have much to contribute. Let’s see, you contributed
people without question will learn and at least think
twice about Sure Trader, they’re gonna now know about the cool trading function of chart
trader with Interactive Brokers for those that are visual people, they’re going to understand kind of how you kinda do your
scans and stuff for the job so there’s three things
right off the top of my head where you thought you didn’t
have much to contribute. Tom, he just dropped some
major experience bombs on newer traders or really
anybody listening, right? Anybody who says they don’t have much to contribute or say is always the ones who have great pieces
of advice for people. So, yes, just like we had
predicted in the beginning a ton of great little
nuggets of information for not only new traders but for those who have been around the
block a couple times too. I appreciate it. And a personal thank you
from both Chezz and I, you volunteered, I sent out
an email relatively recently saying hey, is anybody up
for telling their story and you replied back so this was not like us pulling teeth so in all seriousness and sincerity thank you very much. It always makes our life much easier. Now, would you come back? That’s really the next big question so we can hear about how this continues to unfold for you, so at a later date would you be willing to hang out again? I’d love to, I’d love to. And when I come back I’d like to say yeah, so now I’ve got
it or it’s all clicking. Because right now it’s at the point where I don’t have it but certain things click. Oh, it’s comin’ and I’m almost there, and eventually I want to be there. Yeah, no, and like I said at the beginning I’ve
watched your progress, and you’re definitely making
progress in the right direction and, I mean, at the end of the day as long as you keep that strength of
being just a grumpy old guy when it comes to honoring that stop loss that’s a great characteristic to have. Your account will be around a long time if you can just manage risk like you seem to be pretty gung-ho about. So, Tom, thank you very
much for hanging out and I appreciate you taking
some time out of your day. Thank you guys, I appreciate it. For you listeners out there a final few things before we go. First off if you are listening on YouTube check out the rest of the channel, lots of other good content,
lots of live trading videos, quick tip videos, there’s a vlog, lots of good stuff so
check out the other videos and hopefully ultimately decide
to subscribe to the channel, if you’re listening on
Itunes or any of the other podcast players be sure
to subscribe so you can be up to date on when new
episodes are released. Especially on Itunes if you
could leave us a positive rating that goes a long way and helps
Chezz and I out quite a bit. And finally if you are
listening on the show notes page at be sure
to leave us a comment below, click that share button,
we do read comments, we will reply to them
and are more than happy to interact with you if
you have something to say or feedback to give or whatever. So thank you again to our
esteemed cohost Chezz, thank you again to our guest Tom, and thank you to you as viewers, we’ll see you back next week.
(upbeat music) This has been The Stock Trading Reality Podcast, thanks for taking
the time to hang out. To learn more about Clay and
the Clay Trader community including the trading
team, premium training, and more visit


  • Reply im trying to break out the matrix October 23, 2017 at 4:55 pm

    Is penny pro a bad one?

  • Reply monteros October 23, 2017 at 11:09 pm

    Just got back from the UP 🙂 Lived here my entire life.

  • Reply Toxic Tank October 24, 2017 at 8:02 am

    Can someone in America issue a cease and desist because you talked about them? A first hand account at that. It shouldn't be any different than some reviewing a product online. Other than not wanting to banter with the snake oil salesman.

  • Reply Anttjuan Reid October 27, 2017 at 5:30 am

    What I mostly remember about Michigan is how cold it was and all the snow everywhere. It was during winter. Oh yeah, and I also remember Detroit lol.

  • Reply Jordan Buskow November 6, 2017 at 6:35 pm

    Your marketing sold me on your honesty, in the end a person needs to trust there gut. Thanks Tom and the gang for the information on what to look for in a brokerage. I have been thinking of interactive brokers, now I'll really have to check out their platform. This episode is a must for anyone getting started in trading. PPH.

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